N64 Issues with Stretched 2X, 4X and Jittery/Screen teared 5X

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  • #22322
    Yawnny
    Participant

    Hi all,

    Received my OSSC yeserday, really happy about that (and tomorrows the weekend!)

    I’m running an RGBS signal out my my N64 (Tim’s board with Borti’s firmware running de-blur) terminating in SCART to the OSSC.

    My OSSC is connected to an LG B6 4K OLED.

    Line 3X has been the winner for me up to this point. I’m overall quite happy with this mode. The reason for my post is oddities with other modes and why they’re happening.

    In Line 2X and 4X modes the image is stretched across the screen and the colors are overblown (really bright and cold looking). In the video options menu I have “Generic 4:3” set for these modes. Switching between “Generic 4:3” and other aspect ratios while in 2X and 4X makes the screen go black for a second but returns to the same stretched image.

    Line 3X works great. Everything fits, image is sharp, aspect ratio is 4:3 and looking fantastic.

    Line 4X is identical situation as 2X.. I don’t notice any quality difference compared to 2X because it’s the same stretched ‘overblown’ image.

    Line 5X the aspect ratio is correct 4:3 and image is sharp, however, there is screen tearing and jittering. There’s enough stuttering and jittering that it seems to add lag to Mario 64 in addition to what lag the game has (I have a lag counter running on my Mario 64 Practice rom).

    I’ve read that people have had great success with LG OLEDs but only 3X is really acceptable to me when running N64 240P.. perhaps this is just how N64 240P behaves in 5X mode?

    Trying to adjust aspect ratio settings within my TV doesn’t seem to have an affect on the 2X, 4X stretching.. although I don’t think I care about 2X, 4X if i can get better performance out of the 5X mode.

    One odd thing to note as well when switching between line multiple modes. Sometimes my TV would appear to all of a sudden add the ‘TruMotion’ motion processing filter.. at least, I THINK this what was happening. Mario 64 would have that crappy “soap opera” motion processing look to it.. the only way I could get this setting off was to switch TV modes from some other setting back to Game Mode (User)..which I confirmed has TruMotion OFF although it seems like it was switching line multiple modes that triggered this? Very odd.

    Anyone else have any issues with 5X with the N64 such as screen tearing. etc…?

    #22323
    Fnnrqwin
    Participant

    I have this same TV and I run my N64 in 5x with no problems. I’ll post my settings when I get home.

    #22324
    Yawnny
    Participant

    I really appreciate that. Looking forward to how you have it set up!

    #22326
    Yawnny
    Participant

    I went home at lunch and did some more tweaking. I fixed a couple of my issues.

    1. The aspect ratio issue: I thought my LG B6 had “Original” in the Aspect Ratio option, but turns out it did NOT.. it was set to 16:9

    Now that I have the aspect ratio set to “Orignal” all line multiple modes appear correct

    2. The screen tearing issue: When in 5X only the 1920×1080 tears. 1600×1200 does NOT tear.

    My question: Is 1600×1200 the more appropriate 5x mode for 240P? 1920×1080 seems to be cutoff for the 240P games on the N64 anyway, 1600×200 leaves some small black bars on the top and bottom of the screen, but nothing major. I presume this is normal?

    3. The screen jittering issue: It turns out it may be my RGB mod that is causing a bit of shaking. I hooked up the N64 to my Extron which output to my OSSC AND my PVM.. If I look close at my PVM there is a bit of shaking but I just didn’t notice it before!!

    My mod was done by Leon Kiriliuk, who seems to have a great reputation and I loved dealing with him.

    My question: What could be a solution to this? Some mentioned an RGB amp might solve the “shaky” picture (most noticeable on 2D elements such as the Pilotwings 64 mission select screen or the HUD items on Mario 64 such as star count and life count).

    Another question
    Does the OSSC remember your settings if you Save a profile? So far I only have one profile (Profile 0) saved with 5X, as that’s all I’ll be using, but it seems that sometimes I’ll turn off the OSSC and when I turn it back on it’s set to 2x.

    I appreciate all the help!

    P.S Fnnrqin. I’d still love to see your settings!

    #22331
    Yawnny
    Participant

    Hello again,

    Further tinkering now that I’m off work and have a beer in me 🙂 Thank goodness for the weekend!

    Update on 3. The screen jittering issue: Leon (my modder) and I were discussing this afternoon and he let me know that the little jitters I was detecting was due to Borti’s De-Blur firmware acting up. Sure enough, if I turn off de-blur, the image looks jitter free! Again, the jitter really isn’t that bad. Just noticeable on some 2D elements, but rarely, if ever, during gameplay.

    I’m going to order up a USB Blaster to flash the borti firmware, see if that helps. Another problem that wasn’t the OSSC, yay!

    One of my remaining questions is in regards to one of the Sticky threads about 4X/5X tweaking.
    The sticky thread mentions the following:

    Lx5 mode (Generic 4:3)
    Note, This may require a 1200 line capable panel.
    Note 2, this might only work if Lx5 already works with your 263 line console, but not your 262 line console.

    1. Decrease H.Samplerate to 1950
    2. Increase H.Active to 1600 (4:3 for 1200 lines) OR decrease H.Active to 1440 (4:3 for 1080 lines).
    3. Adjust H.Sync & H.Backporch as needed.

    I can’t seem to find these options in any of the sub-menus of the OSSC. Are these located in some kind of service menu? If I can see a good clean picture, should I even bother with these settings?

    #22334
    NoAffinity
    Participant

    ^Go to sampling opt -> scroll up one to <adv. timing>. You will find them in advance timing.

    #22335
    BuckoA51
    Keymaster

    My question: Is 1600×1200 the more appropriate 5x mode for 240P? 1920×1080 seems to be cutoff for the 240P games on the N64 anyway, 1600×200 leaves some small black bars on the top and bottom of the screen, but nothing major. I presume this is normal?

    320 x 5 = 1600
    240 x 5 = 1200

    So yes, 1600×1200 is ideal for line 5x mode, but of course it depends if your TV supports it and how well it scales it. You can see why some of the image has to be cropped in 1080p Line 5x mode.

    #22337
    Yawnny
    Participant

    ^Go to sampling opt -> scroll up one to <adv. timing>. You will find them in advance timing.

    Perfect, thank you!

    320 x 5 = 1600
    240 x 5 = 1200

    So yes, 1600×1200 is ideal for line 5x mode, but of course it depends if your TV supports it and how well it scales it. You can see why some of the image has to be cropped in 1080p Line 5x mode.

    Exactly the kind of confirmation I was looking for, much appreciated! I’m so happy that the LG B6 displays every mode, every resolution, so I can choose the best look.

    Appreciate all the help.
    Happy Saturday.

    #22340
    paulb_nl
    Participant

    Line5x H.active is set to 1536 by default which crops part of the sides with the N64. You’ll want to set H.active to 1600 and tweak H.backporch to center the screen.

    #22343
    BuckoA51
    Keymaster

    Line5x H.active is set to 1536 by default which crops part of the sides with the N64. You’ll want to set H.active to 1600 and tweak H.backporch to center the screen.

    I noticed that last night when I was using my OSSC. I wonder if that’s a bug? I’ll have to ask Markus.

    #22344
    paulb_nl
    Participant

    Its not really a bug but thats just the settings that were chosen for line5x. The aspect ratio is also too wide so the defaults should be changed.

    I have done some testing and these are the settings where both the circles in the SNES 240p linearity test are the correct size and the file select screen in Mario 64 is not cropped:

    H.active: 1600
    H.samplerate: 1976
    H.synclen 150
    H.backporch 160

    However the above settings only work properly in 1600×1200 mode. The below settings also work in 1920 modes but it is cropped a bit:

    H.active: 1600
    H.samplerate: 1990
    H.synclen 150
    H.backporch 168

    #22345
    Yawnny
    Participant

    My H.backporch value is 149 and now the image is exactly centered as per my measuring tape from edge of screen to start of picture.

    H.active at 1600 makes the image look more correct horizontally.

    I set my H.samplerate to 1950 as per the sticky thread but I’m not sure what I’m watching for when changing this value.

    Would someone mind letting me know what to keep an eye on when adjusting H.samplerate?

    Overall my picture looks great and seems correctly proportioned and positioned. I Had my Extron output to my PVM at the same time as my OSSC and everything seems to be lining up in comparison, I just want to make sure I’m not missing something.

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