OSSC sync issues combined with Extron crosspoint Ultra 168

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  • #16010
    BuckoA51
    Keymaster

    If the OSSC isn’t losing sync I struggle to see how it’s the Extron that’s the problem. A real mystery…

    #16025
    vasilas432
    Participant

    So far I blame the monitor. But it is a real mystery.
    OSSC light is red only with Taito F3

    #16044
    vasilas432
    Participant

    But better to check it again about blinking. I will put OSSC in front of the monitor

    #16206
    vasilas432
    Participant

    Today I succesfuly connected my Extron crosspoint 168 to an Extron SMX 8×4 hdmi switcher (what a beast) and ouput to the monitor. Unfortunately when using some pcbs with my supergun and the signal is comming through analog Extron to the monitor, there has still random sync drops for 1 sec. So far I don’t have drops when the supergun connects directly to OSSC. N64 and super Famicom play ok trough Extron though. I still have to try the other consoles and have the full report. I am still invastigating this strange cause

    My Dell monitor has some color presets. While I have read that in “Game” mode it still has the same lag, choosing Game mode just for testing purpose, when conncted with the supergun through OSSC (with or without Extron) sync drops for ever

    #16348
    vasilas432
    Participant

    Hi Bucko,
    After some more testing I was able to see OSSC blinking red for 1 sec when my monitor drops sync. So this is OSSC when connected to Extron causing random sync drops. Actually I was able to spot the blinking because in Knights of the Round pcb it looses sync in a specific spot in the beginning of the credit!!!

    Any clue if I can switch settings for a possible fix?

    Thanks

    #16361
    BuckoA51
    Keymaster

    always the same spot? Is the screen particularly bright or anything at that moment?

    #16364
    vasilas432
    Participant

    90% of the time it happens on the same spot. It happens when you go to hit the first enemy you encounter among the 2 barrels in Knights of the Round https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drEZ45CkE3U. There is a 10% when it happens on next wave of enemies and once happened in player select screen. That spot doesn’t seem brighter or unusual

    Tonight I will connect OSSC using the line out of the PVM just to check once again that it doesn’t only happen when Extron is involved.
    Once again when OSSC is connected directly to the supergun and outputs either DVI or HDMI (using my digital Hdmi Extron I have fed both inputs of the monitor at the same time) blinking never ever happens. This is madness

    #16378
    vasilas432
    Participant

    I tried outputting to OSSC from PVM line out and there is blinking to OSSC, same thing as outputting from Extron. So there is nothing wrong with Extron’s output signal and cables are working fine.
    I also fed everything from a different wall power socket. There is something OSSC doesn’t like when feeding from another device. Maybe Marqs can understand the situation and enlighten us. What is going on with those CPS1 games (even though I think there is blinking with MVS and Irem M92 too). It is still a mystery.

    In the meanwhile PC Engine Duo R plays perfectly fine on OSSC through Extron, like Super Famicom and RGB N64 before. Still a few consoles to go.

    #16481
    darkstrider2
    Participant

    Hi Bucko,

    I have a very similar setup as vasilas432 (Crosspoint Ultra 88 HVA w/ ADSP). I also want to add that I am also plagued with these every since I received the OSSC 1.5 over the summer, I’ve been troubleshooting slowly trying to find a solution to random 1-2s sync drops. Here’s what I’ve observed:

    Setup:
    – WindyGaming SuperGun -> PVMin -> PVMout -> Crosspoint-in -> Crosspoint-out (w/ resistor) -> OSSC -> HDMI Splitter -> (HDTV, Monitor 1, Monitor 2)

    Observations:
    1. This only happens with 240p scaling, doesn’t matter what mode (2x-5x). Doesn’t happen with 480i or 480p inputs through the same scart OSSC input.
    2. Maxing “Analog sync Vth” seems to alleviate the problem somewhat, but doesn’t appear to aid other systems. It helped with CPS2 (ran 30 min with no drops). But not with CPS3 (seems like every 3-5 minutes, changing sync Vth didn’t seem to affect the interval between sync drops).
    3. Not just a Arcade thing. I’ve experience random drops 2x-5x using Wii running SNES VC in 240p (RGBs).
    4. Not a monitor specific issue. With the HDMI Splitter, when the sync drops, the red LED lights up for 1-2 seconds and all monitors black out for 1-2 seconds.
    5. (Not confirmed) I vaguely recall having these drops when I first tested the OSSC connecting the SuperGun directly to the OSSC into my monitor.
    6. I also the Crosspoint outputting the same signal to the Framemeister, and it doesn’t experience these dropouts.

    At this point, I’m really stumped. If you or Marqs need some addition user testing to diagnose (like giving specific OSSC settings) if it’s really an OSSC thing (I’m concluding it’s more likely than the Crosspoint being it), just let me know what to test.

    #16483
    vasilas432
    Participant

    1. Thanks for pointing this.
    2. Maxing V sync will cause issues to other hardware?
    3. Is default SNES res to 240p or it is in VC only? I have played more than half an hour super famicom with no drops
    4. It’s definitely not a monitor issue
    5. I bought a bandridge passive switch and put it in OSSC input. No 1 is connected to supergun, No 2 accepts Extron. Extron has everything else hooked. While playing supergun Extron’s output must be muted or sync drops. Somehow it affects bandridge. Played more than half an hour successfully but with Extron muted when connected to no 2 bandridge input.
    6. I bought a Framemeister too, it’s on its way to me.

    You have connected your monitor before Extron and before OSSC. This may be worse. I experience drop outs when the monitor is before OSSC even if Extron is out of the way. This means Extron is fine. I have narrowed issue to 2 things. Supergun or OSSC. I believe OSSC has more possibilities to be responsible. If cr4zymanz0r’s OSSC has no issues using EXTRON then we may have to RMA our OSSC units.

    Thanks for your feedback, I am still testing.

    #16484
    darkstrider2
    Participant

    2. Increasing vsync I’ve found can only help the problem. With CPS2, that seemed to eliminate drops entirely. With CPS3, drops happen at the same frequency whether it’s default setting or max.
    3. SNES VC runs 240p when you set the Wii to 480i. 480p when set to 480p. Same thing with NES.

    Yea, I believe I will experience the same symptoms if the Extron/PVM is out the way. I’m willing to temporarily gut my setup and do direct input OSSC testing if Marqs or Bucko recommend something/settings to test.

    Edit: I wonder if it’s just interference from all the analog devices. The OSSC is surrounded by electronics after all.

    #16486
    vasilas432
    Participant

    OSSC is not affected by surroundings. I have thought about that and tested OSSC in some distance away. Still sync drops.

    You can try to confirm the following test if you like. Feed OSSC of the monitor’s line out and leave Extron out. If I am correct you will have sync drops this way too. I think having both the monitor and Extron before OSSC my be the worst case scenario.

    There is a negative for me using the Bandridge right now. I have added an additional 1,5 meters cable Bandridge line out which means that signal travels 3 meters cable to go to OSSC. If I complete testing and 3 meters prove to work flawlessly then it means Extron and PVM line out have circuits that OSSC doesn’t like.

    #16494
    darkstrider2
    Participant

    I did some testing with other consoles with my setup. (e.g: Consles to Extron to OSSC), and can confirm that NES, SNES, N64 doesn’t have any drops after running for awhile.

    I’m inclined to believe the random drops is specific with particular systems which output 240p, e.g: CPS2, CPS3. For the CPS2 to work with the Framemesiter from my Supergun, it required a SCART to BNC w/ sync cleaner stripper to the Extron for Framemeister to display clean video (was half video/half flickering garbled before the using a adding a cleaner ciruit. The OSSC didn’t require it to work with the Extron; however the random drops has always been present.

    According to the OSSC wiki, CPS2 doesn’t require specific settings; I truly wonder if that is the case; and CPS2/3 and other odd arcade boards need particular settings so it doesn’t drop sync like SNES was previously.

    #16495
    vasilas432
    Participant

    scart to bnc with stripper—>Extron—>bnc to scart—>framemeister/OSSC . Wasn’t that your setting in general? Extron needs to be fed with clear sync and if the consoles don’t output clear sync then a sync stripper is required in the scart to bnc cable. If there isn’t clear sync Extron won’t output anything.

    I think we are alone in the globe with CPS issues which means that our OSSC units are faulty. We both have researched a lot and tried anything to make sync drops disappear.

    #16496
    darkstrider2
    Participant

    Yes, all my consoles/SuperGun RGBs connects to the Extron with csync. Yea, tried everything.

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