Dreamcast with OSSC + Toro RGB: fuzzy image

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  • #27242
    KentaZX
    Participant

    So I was trying to set my Dreamcast up in the OSSC with the Toro box, which has been put on VGA (RGB give me 524i instead of 524p), with a SCART cable plugged in, and I’ve tried the settings FireBrandX used as well, and I get 524p signal according to the OSSC (is that normal or correct?). The result I get is the image looks fuzzy, not sharp. I’ve tried this with pluggin a VGA cable as well and it gives the exact same result as RGB did. (well it didn’t give audio out either despite turning on AV 3 fix in the settings) Any help on this?

    was I supposed to use a button combo for a game to force it into 480p as well? The games I’ve tested so far were Sonic Adventure, Chu Chu Rocket and Soul Calibur.

    Another thing to add, Trying passthrough instead of 2X gave a sharper picture, but I did feel a little bit of input lag too.

    #27271
    BuckoA51
    Keymaster

    Shouldn’t really be any difference between passthrough and 2x in terms of lag unless your TV is slower at scaling 480p than 960p (unlikely).

    Interesting you say that the VGA cable gives you the same results though. Is this what you’re seeing :- https://videogameperfection.com/forums/topic/dreamcast-ossc-480p-2x-settings-for-retro-access-scart-cable/

    #27274
    nmalinoski
    Participant

    When using the Toro, the switch in the bank of four switches that is closest to the console toggles between 15kHz (240p/288p/480i/576i) output and 31kHz (480p) output; so, if the OSSC is reporting that you’re only getting 480i (525i), then you need to flip that switch to 31kHz and restart the console. If you boot a game and says that it’s incompatible with the attached AV cable, flip that switch back to 15kHz, restart the console, and then flip the switch back to 31kHz when you see the white SEGA licensing screen.

    What’s confusing is that there’s a second, harder-to-get-to RGBS/RGBHV toggle between the DE-15 and SCART outputs, but that only toggles whether the DE-15 output uses composite sync or separate sync. The SCART output will always output RGBS, regardless of whether the console is outputting 15kHz RGBS or 31kHz RGBHV.

    Additionally, I would recommend recommend getting a male-to-male SCART cable and using that to connect the Dreamcast to the OSSC; AV3 lacks low pass filtering for anything below 960p/1080i/1080p, whereas AV1 (and AV2) has low-pass filtering for the video modes used by the Dreamcast, and it’s configured for DTV 480p by default. If you want to continue using AV3, that’s fine, but you should change 480p in sampler to DTV 480p so you get the correct aspect ratio.

    #27291
    KentaZX
    Participant

    @Nmalinoski, I rather use AV1 since im getting audio from there at least. but i ever knew i was SUPPOSED to flip the switch back to 15KHz after the sega logo. I will test again with this and report back to see if this changes anything. (the ossc been reporting 524p) so it wasn’t on 480 i)

    EDIT: flipping that switch with AV1 made no difference, and AV3 just doesn’t give out any signal.


    @BuckoA51
    I’ve been checking that thread out too, but my VGA wasn’t sharp as his VGA example though. Also I thought passthrough wouldn’t lag either, but when i was playing sonic adventure, i’ve felt a slight bit of lag when making Sonic jump and move around. in 2x, I didn’t feel any lag.

    ALSO, I’ve been testing with Soul Calibur, sonic adventure and chu chu rocket. Do those games have anything to do with my issue?

    UPDATE: Okay I’m just gonna upload two screenshots, the first is using VGA(AV3) and the second is using AV1/RGB scart:

    View post on imgur.com

    View post on imgur.com

    do these look alright? can they be improved? is that how they’re supposed to look?

    #27347
    BuckoA51
    Keymaster

    Aspect ratio is obviously wrong. Can you check text for ghosting?

    #27351
    nmalinoski
    Participant

    @nmalinoski, I rather use AV1 since im getting audio from there at least.

    If you’re already using the SCART output from the Toro to connect to AV1 on the OSSC, that’s fine; that’s what I was trying to recommend. 🙂

    but i ever knew i was SUPPOSED to flip the switch back to 15KHz after the sega logo. I will test again with this and report back to see if this changes anything. (the ossc been reporting 524p) so it wasn’t on 480 i)

    EDIT: flipping that switch with AV1 made no difference, and AV3 just doesn’t give out any signal.

    Just to be clear, when you’re tricking a 480i game into displaying 480p, you need to boot the console in 15kHz/480i and then flip the switch on the Toro 31kHz/480p during that white Sega licensing screen, as soon as possible after it appears. If you flip it after it goes away, it won’t work; and at no point after booting the console should you need to flip it back to 15kHz. You also don’t need to do this with any game that normally supports 480p.

    #27353
    KentaZX
    Participant

    @Bucko: what the correct aspect ratio? I did enabled the DTV thing in the sampling section of the ossc though according to firebrandX’s timing profile…or was I not supposed to do that?

    as for the text, yea there were some ghosting, but as longsunzhao did before, I’ve increased the reverse LPF thing up to 7 to reduce it.


    @nmalinoski
    : Ah I see. so its only for the 480i games. I need to google that list later.

    #27355
    nmalinoski
    Participant

    @Bucko: what the correct aspect ratio? I did enabled the DTV thing in the sampling section of the ossc though according to firebrandX’s timing profile…or was I not supposed to do that?

    You should set your TV to display Dreamcast games in 4:3, unless they specifically have a widescreen mode. (Same goes for PS2 and GameCube.)

    You only need to specifically enable DTV 480p if you’re using the Dreamcast through AV3; if you’re using it through SCART, you can leave it at Auto. This is because the Dreamcast outputs 480p at DTV 720×480, not VGA 640×480, and the default configuration for AV3 assumes you’ll be using it for VGA-compliant sources, like PCs, not typical consumer video equipment.

    #27356
    longsun_zhao
    Participant

    Yeah the reverse LPF as more of a last resort for me. There is definitely a tradeoff there, especially when it’s turned up before 3-4. I can’t recommend using it on consoles besides unmodded SNESs and I really wish the blur wasn’t there to start with.

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